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Blogs > templar_s > The Mind Of A Good Bad Boy

Michael Vick: Still In The House..  

templar_s 54M
214 posts
10/5/2010 8:36 am
Michael Vick: Still In The House..
I was watching the Redskins/Eagles game on Sunday, and of course, I was glad to see the Redskins win that game to even their season record to 2-2. While Donovan McNabb did a fairly decent job, I couldn't help but feel 2 obvious facts, even as a non-Eagles fan:

1. Michael Vick took a vicious hit at the goal line, and that hit sidelined him off that game, and perhaps one or two more games.

2. The only reason the Redskins won that game was because of Michael Vick being sidelined due to said vicious hit-the only answer that Redskins defense had for Vick was to put him out of business, albeit temporarily.

I decided to post this commentary because when it comes to Michael Vick, based on people that I've spoken to, there appears to be 3 camps of opinions out there. There are people who love animals so much that there could never be any hope of redemption or forgiveness for Vick. Then there are people who really don't care about animals that much, and just think that Vick is a good football player. I'm with the 3rd camp-the ones who feel that, as much as I care about animals, I believe that once someone has done a crime and done his or her time, he or she deserves a second chance at getting on with their lives, talent be damned.

If I ever committed a crime, be it white collar, blue collar, or however people choose to categorize the crime, I would hope that, as a human being, after being punished for my crime, I can move on, and my REAL friends would still be my friends, or at least allow me that second chance. We have a system of justice in this country where we are judged by a jury of our peers, and whatever happens in court, that is the system that we have, and we have to accept it. That's not to say that guilty people haven't gotten away with crimes, or that innocent people have not been wrongly convicted for crimes they didn't commit, but this is our criminal justice system, and we have to abide by it as a society. Don't like it? Try living in Iran, where you can be killed for cheating on your spouse, or North Korea, where you can be imprisoned for being in possession of a non-D.P.R.K. publication, or even United Arab Emirates, where public displays of affection between an unmarried couple will land you in prison-I guarantee you'll be back!

Now, that is not to say that people have no right to their feelings. I'm not saying that you have to love a Michael Vick, or a Michael Jackson, or a Roman Polanski, or an Aileen Wuornos(eek!), or any other person you may view as a menace to society-I'm just saying that you have to allow them to get on with their lives once they've been punished for their crimes. For someone to wish a Michael Vick harm, or death, now that he is no longer cruel to animals...is that really fair?

At the end of the day, the criminal justice system has released him, because he has served his punishment. He served time in prison, and he lost a lot of his wealth, and a lot of his dignity, and he's trying to rebuild all those thinks. I think that it's only fair that he be allowed to prove himself worthy.

I'm not a Philadelphia Eagles fan, but I have to admit it-he may not be a heck of a guy, but Michael Vick is one heck of a football player-please let him play.
canyaz 56F
17128 posts
10/5/2010 11:44 am

 Well stated. Vick is the poster boy for animal abuser only because he is a public figure. Now oddly I kind of fit all categories of your impromptu poll. My stomach cringes at the idea of the type of cruelty he facilitated. I agree, he has served his punishment. He has a right to move on and he has talent.
I know, as a shrink, cruel people rarely change. Now is he a cruel person or just enjoys the sport for which he was punished? I am not in a position to judge...I do know the Fantasy Football guys said trade Vick quick! That was before the game and based on performance.
I didn't have him on my Fantasy team so I don't have to worry about it.
Good post.
There is a difference between a good BJ and a bad BJ.
canyaz


templar_s replies on 10/5/2010 2:52 pm:
I truly appreciate your expert viewpoint on this subject matter, Ms. C. You posted an interesting question: dog fighting, cock fighting, extreme human fighting and the like..are they considered sport, or acts of cruelty? What about football? Death occurs from all these sports, as a matter of fact. Thanks for weighing in.

spiceyblond 56F
5388 posts
10/5/2010 1:14 pm

 Celebrity "crime" is such a hot subject, but in reality, they're only human... I'm even thinking back to Phelps... How many gold medals did this man win for the USA in the Olympics? 8 or 9? Yet, someone with a camera catches him smoking a joint, and he's vanished...

People are people. None of us are perfect, none of us without fault. I'm all for second chances... 3rd chances may be a little harder to swallow, but at the end of the day, it's really none of our business, ya know...


templar_s replies on 10/5/2010 2:58 pm:
I agree-third chances may be tough, but second chances are necessary. I'm not quite sure I agree about Michael Phelps, though-sure he may have been slightly tarnished by the chronic-gate, but his sport is not one that enjoys year-round exposure, and other than the Olympics, swimming is not talked about much in this country. Add the fact that he still has his Subway endorsement, and I doubt Phelps is hurting all that much. Thanks for reading, darling.

rm_geysergirl 59F
10799 posts
10/5/2010 6:21 pm

 I'm with the 3rd camp.. he may have done dispicable and unforgivable things that as a pet lover have me aghast, which we can only hope he will never do again.. but the other side of him is his talent and livelihood and the latter should not be taken away from him because of his actions outside of football. As I mentioned, it was hard for me to reconcile the 2 sides, but there is a line/boundary. Let him play and move on with his professional life..
Captivate my mind...and who knows what will follow. Discover more of my ramblings at [blog geysergirl]


templar_s replies on 10/6/2010 3:47 am:
You know, G.G., I feel that way more so because he was punished for what he did. As a result, he deserves to be able to move on. Thanks for weighing in.

TALL_GUY_IN_STL 49M  
102 posts
10/5/2010 8:57 pm

 I'm in the 3rd camp. I believe people can redeem themselves -- some people. I believe people like Michael Vick are evil to the core. So much so that they don't even realize what they are doing is wrong. Torturing and killing dogs for entertainment is wrong. I don't believe Vick had an epiphany one day and figured out that what he was doing was wrong. I think he's trying to salvage his image as well as his career by going around to schools and "teaching" kids that what he did was wrong. If we need to teach children that torturing and killing dogs is wrong, God help us.

Michael Vick paid his debt to society in a legal sense. In the hearts and minds of good people, he never will.


templar_s replies on 10/6/2010 3:52 am:
I think I understand that, but you can look at another criminal perspective. I think that a drug dealer who comes out of prison, and teaches kids the dangers of dealing and doing drugs is a good thing-even if he had killed people in the past. It's called redemption.

How do you feel about ultimate fighting, where it's not animals fighting, but it's people? People die in those fights, and I'm talking about the ones in back alleys, not the ones that we see on TV sponsored by Budweiser. I just think that people should be allowed a chance to right a wrong, and not have their characters permanently condemned. At least I know that if I ever do something wrong, that's what I would want. Thanks for commenting on this, man.

rm_kelidgh 61F
15971 posts
10/6/2010 4:44 am

 What so very many refuse to understand (or may not understand) is that there are several "camps" of animal owners in this country, and that many are influenced by the environment in which they were raised. In some households, cockfighting is one of those standard Saturday evening events, others have dogfighting, still others go to the racetrack. All are enmeshed with gambling, and most of the participants view the animals as little more than a moneymaker. Vick went to jail for what he did, yet many others are arrested on the same charges, without jail being a consequence. His name and fame got him the 18 months much more than the death of dogs. And, what all fail to notice, and the outrage was NIL, was the woman who led the charge against him in Virginia, the head of that state's ASPCA, left her own dog in her closed car in July 09, without water or air, and the dog died as a result of her neglect. Yet, she was allowed to post a statement about the "terrible mistake" and her "profound grief" and keep her 60K plus per year position. That fact alone, shows that there was a "fame based" motivation in the prosecutorial efforts, as no charges or investigation was ever launched in her direction.
As for Vick, he did wrong, and has made extensive efforts to both educate himself and others as to that wrong. He served time, lost all of his endorsements, money, homes and good name. He was thought worthy of a chance by the Eagles, has made some amazing plays for them, and earned the respect of his teammates, coaches and fans.
That hit he took on Saturday took him out of the game, and I think we all can agree no player wants to be taken out like that. He needs to be allowed to play, to work forward and move forward, he is trying. Are we really going to say that he is to apologize for years, for mistakes and actions that he has both served jail time for and done the work to educate himself and others about the horrors of those actions? I think we have far bigger and more pressing issues that need attention and address in this country, one QB in the 30 NFL teams should not be the focus on which all have opinion. It would be refreshing should more have informed opinions about the political system, the upcoming election or fixing education.

~ [blog kelidgh]~ I am, indeed


templar_s replies on 10/6/2010 9:08 am:
You have actually introduced another angle to this discussion, and one I was unaware of-hypocrisy. The political system in this country, by design, is a very good one, but unfortunately, it's also based on the honor system. It will work as designed only as long as it's run by honest people. Sadly, we now live in an era where the term 'honest politician' has become an oxymoron. I feel sorry for Vick, because he got caught up in a web of ulterior motives. At the end of the day, he has a strong work ethic, and he's very talented, so I'm rooting for him to prevail, which he very well may. Thanks for your insightful input, Ms. K.

TheRedheadinHeat 62F
9294 posts
10/6/2010 6:48 am

 It is what it is! While the judicial system in our country is actually a "good" system, we allow the rich and famous to get away with "murder" while we "normal" people pay the price. If we would actually take politics and celebrity status out of the equation, I think it would work much better.

Do I care for Vick? Not in the least. I think the man should be castrated and have the dogs turned loose on him. Just as I think every true out there should be castrated and fed his balls. We aren't even going to get into my feelings toward child abusers and what I think should happen to them. However, these are just my feelings and nothing on which I am going to act.

Should Vick be allowed to play football? That is irrelevant because the man is playing football so let him play.
If I have stopped by your blog, please be sure to sign my permission slip Pimp Me, Pimp My Blog, But Let Me Do The Same With You


templar_s replies on 10/6/2010 9:28 am:
Well-said, Red. Though I must admit..the image of balls being eaten..not very pretty.

TALL_GUY_IN_STL 49M  
102 posts
10/6/2010 9:16 am

 Are we to forgive Hitler? Saddam Hussein? Osama bin Laden? I'd say most people would not. Perhaps a greater number of people are willing to forgive Vick because he tortured and killed dogs (viewed as lesser beings), not people. I'm not one of those people. I will not forgive him nor will I forget his vile acts.

His acts say more about the essence of Michael Vick. An ex-addict who goes around telling kids not to do drugs or deal drugs, at the very least, can say that he/she did terrible things because the drugs put them in a different state of mind. If one of those terrible things includes murder, then I cannot forgive them either.

The back alley fighting analogy isn't a good one. Those participants choose to fight and may actually be rewarded monetarily. Dogs who participate in dog fights are not there by their own choosing and if they win, their reward is that they get to fight again.

I'm with you. I do believe in the human spirit and giving a person a chance to redeem themselves if they've done something wrong. However, there are certain acts that are so horrific, those that commit them, in my mind, are beyond redemption. In my opinion, child molesters, murderers and animal abusers are in that category.


templar_s replies on 10/6/2010 9:56 am:
That sort of goes into the categorization of sins, and sure, some acts are more horrific than others, but there are horrific acts where deaths does not occur, but may leave people scarred for the rest of their lives. Drug dealers kill people sometimes as a necessity to stay alive, or as a scare tactic to protect their turfs-Drug dealers rarely do Drugs, and that's what people mistake about the trade-there are Drug users, and Drug dealers. The bottom line is, Drug dealers are very ruthless people because they have to be, but that doesn't excuse their crimes. If they can turn away from that life, and they can successfully steer other people from it, I can forgive their past, because they are making changes. Drug addicts only get punished for being in possession of illegal substances-their abuse of said substances hurt no one but themselves, just like you described a prize fighter.

You may think that Micheal Vick doesn't fit that category, but that's only if you believe that he can never change from being an animal abuser. If you do, and if he can discourage others from doing it, he deserves forgiveness for trying to reverse a trend that he may have been a part of. While I do think that some people are incorrigible, Michael Vick has yet to prove to be, so he deserves the benefit of a doubt. I think he got a bum because of his celebrity, because he lost a lot more than other dog fighters who continue business as usual, even as we speak. At least, he's now trying to do the right thing.

Thanks again.

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